2 tips to run cooler

1fast2liter · Post by **1fast2liter** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 1:13 am

besides that alot of second gens are also plastic too.

Lackof · Post by **Lackof** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 7:30 am

I gotta say i also think the plastic mani runs cooler.

I have owned both in 2 different cars and my sohc def. ran much cooler.

I know however if you paint the dohc aluminum mani it will keep it cooler.
I painted mine with 1800 degree BBQ grill flat black coating it's def. much cooler inside my bay then it was when it was stock casting.

TomZ · Post by **TomZ** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 8:41 am

1. There are 1GN aluminum SOHC manifolds.

2. The added benefit of increased airflow through a P'nP'd aluminum intake might outweigh the thermal disadvantage . Overall, the performance advantage of a P'nP'd intake (flow vs. heat soak) is somewhat likely, IMHO.

3. The only way to really determine this is to actually measure the various combinations. Any volunteers?

4. I'm using a P'nP'd DOHC intake with plenum and TB spacers. I just ordered a Hondata gasket from Modern, Ill post up my impressions after the install.

5. I wonder what, if any, advantage shielding the aluminum manifold would offer. I'm thinking header wrap, metal exhaust manifold type shields, or sheet heat wrap/shielding. I'm thinking high-tech coatings would also offer some benefit.

http://www.thermaltechcoatings.com/new_page_4.htm

DOHCRT · Post by **DOHCRT** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 10:48 am

purplehayz wrote:Racyneon just made my point .
If plastic is so much batter y is the r/t, Expresso aluminum for thet matter all 2nd gen are 2 as well as srt.
It's not cheaper in fact plastic is much cheaper. I understand the thermal dynamics of it I've got a dagree in physics from Carleton U in Ontario.
Despite the fact it is very pitted but no 1 is arguing p&p capabilities as well as the fact u can boar it right out.
This allows faster less turbulant air flow, increased CFM, The added air flow absorbs more heat then slower more turbulant air. Like DOHCRT said u cant destroy haet and a turbocharger recycles exhust heat.
Once again my point your block will run cooler for that very reason u r reducing the heat in the block by recycling it
I can run my car for half an hour at high rev's, pull over pop the hood and put my hand on the intake yes it's warm but not nearly a hot as the stock Al DOHC mani is
If u r going 2 get in 2 the Thermal dynamics of it that is only half the equation u must take in to acount added air volume and air speed this permotes the transfer of heat. No the car doesnt get an ice cold breath of air but with everything combined the car runs cooler.
And for added effect (my next step) cut a vent in your hood , not a scoop to catch air but a vent to allow more flow under the hood dispersing even more heat. same as removing the weather stripping
I'm not trying to cause an argument but go track side at your local race track and speak with some of the machanics

Your logic is flawed. You don't understand how airflow is affecting intake air temperatures, and I'm pretty sure you didn't get what I said about thermal efficiency.

First of all, I have a 95 SOHC with an aluminum manifold. I also have a turbocharged 98 DOHC with an aluminum manifold (all DOHC engines used aluminum). I just bought a plastic manifold for the SOHC. Those 2 engines will heat soak the manifold within five minutes of running. I have also owned a SOHC with a plastic manifold. That thing never got very hot.

The only reason why the aluminum manifold feels cool after running the engine hard after a while is because the intake air has cooled it. If you were racing in a quarter mile, the manifold would not cool until almost the end of the track. So for 80% of your race, the aluminum manifold has heat soaked your intake air charge. Thats where the plastic manifold comes in. The plastic didn't heat soak in the first place, so the intake air temperature is lower the whole way down the track.

Why do you keep talking about cooling the engine? We want the engine to run at a certain temperature. If the engine was cold all the time, it would suck. Let the cooling system do its job and keep the engine at the right temperature. If for some reason the engine is not running at a desired temperature, you have to make modifications to the cooling system. It all goes back to thermal efficiency. Why do you think piston coatings are so popular? They prevent the piston from transfering some of the combustion temps, keeping that heat in the combustion. The more heat you take from the block, the more heat it will take from the combustion. Why do you think modern engines run so much hotter than older engines?

Bottom line is that the two manifolds have uses in different places. 99% of your neon drivers are going to benefit more from the plastic manifold. Engines that require more airflow than the stock manifold can provide will see a benefit from a ported and polished aluminum manifold. But to start a thread telling everyone with a plastic manifold to run and grab an aluminum one is idiotic. Especially when you're claiming it cools the engine.

neonguru · Post by **neonguru** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 9:58 pm

so does anybody have a pic of how to change the radiator mounts?

Armstrong57 · Post by **Armstrong57** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 12:23 pm

Worst How-To post ever! DOHCRT wins.

Tyler · Post by **Tyler** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 1:54 pm

This thread is hularious!

A plastic manifold which only came on sohc neons run wayy cooler. Once I got my AMM aluminum mani I swear my engine bay temps raised 20*. The plastic mani is smooth on the inside, unlike the stock aluminum one which is as rough as the outside of it.

I completely agree with DOHCRT. Please do not post threads like this again. Its sad that the rest of us that have a brain have to come and clean up messes like this. Go read alot and throw away your keyboard...

neonguru · Post by **neonguru** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:36 pm

soooo, anyone got pics on those radiator mounts? The link on the how to on the first page doesn't work. Really wanting to see if it helps running cooler.

Tyler · Post by **Tyler** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 4:16 pm

Honestly I doubt it would help very much. 1 inch isnt much more air flow compared to a big radiator. Try running Redline Water Wetter in your coolent. I just put some in and Ive heard alot of good feedback about it. Its supossively makes the car run up to 20* cooler.

neonguru · Post by **neonguru** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 5:00 pm

yeah, i just wanted to see what this mod actually did. If it worked or not. Always trying different things, my buddy has a sohc with fully built bottom end and he has heating issues and he is willing to try anything and he wanted to try this one to see if it works.

Tyler · Post by **Tyler** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 5:03 pm

heating issues....hmm...must be something wrong with his cooling system. It shouldnt run warmer just because he has mods to it. Unless he has a smaller radiator or something

neonguru · Post by **neonguru** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 2:32 pm

he does have the small radiator and refuses to switch radiators so with tryin to come up with some other options.

Tyler · Post by **Tyler** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 4:36 pm

It may be his only option....thats one important part of a car! lol

TomZ · Post by **TomZ** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 5:17 pm

neonguru wrote:he does have the small radiator and refuses to switch radiators so with tryin to come up with some other options.

"I reject your reality and substitute it with my own" Mythbusters

There's no magic here. A given coolant capacity will only be able to provide a given temperature drop, flowing over a given surface area. The coolant must reach the temperature required by the PCM to go into "closed loop", so too cold a t-stat won't work. You can only flow so much air with the fan, or airflow due to road speed. Coolant additives will help " a little" but not much. A 60% coolant, 40% water mixture is usually optimum, (check the coolant container to verify). AFAIK there isn't a high flow water pump for the Neon, but there may be. The obvious chioces are: increase coolant capacity, and or, surface area of the radiator. A bigger radiator solves both problems. He's not too bright, is he?

fusion210 · Post by **fusion210** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 6:51 pm

neonguru wrote:he does have the small radiator and refuses to switch radiators so with tryin to come up with some other options.

The 'mounts' are shown by example in the second post. DM racing sold aluminum mounts to move the radiator forward before, I'm usure if they still do, but for free all I did (and others do) is slot the bolt hole in the mount and move it forward. Cake.

This prevents air from escaping from around the radiator.

That begs the question, is he using the OEM or other plastic block offs that go around the half sized radiator in the stock neon? Is he using an unshrouded fan?
There is a big blockoff on the passenger side and a small one on the driver's side to divert air into the radiator instead of the air forming a high pressure zone and going around the radiator. A shroud will make the fan far more efficient at cooling the radiator. Example.

An unshrouded fan is moving air through only that portion of the radiator equal to the surface area of the fan, not the entire radiator. For example, on a normal ’32 Ford radiator, the area of a 15.50" fan is approximately 189 sq. in.; the core of the radiator is approximately 371 sq. in. This means that almost 49% of the unshrouded radiator is not receiving any benefits of the fan. Shrouding your radiator permits the fan to pull air through the entire core of the radiator.

From http://www.musclemotorsports.com/fanshw.html