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Royal Purple Motor Oil

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chris97dohc
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for helping me prove my point of view. these statements are quoted directly from the site.



"Base stock oils (especially the newer GF-3 SL) have better resistance to heat like a synth does"


"A lot of people believe that a full synth oil can protect better than a mineral based oil. Lets look at that scenario."

"If you have a 10w30 mineral oil, that means your base oil has measured to flow between 9.30-12.49 Cst's @ 100deg C."

"If you take a synth 10w30 base oil, that means your base oil(synth) has also measured to flow between the same 9.30-12.49 Cst's @ 100 deg C."

"Follow me so far?, so we now know both oils have the same basic oil flow properties as each other which means that they are pretty much equal in flow."

"So now you have either one in your engine and you step on the gas, and you take off. Oil is in the piston rod bearing right? (at least it better be!) But when the piston pushes down on the crank as illustrated above, it shears or squeezes the oil out momentarily. So, if both oils flow at the same speed, Then which one is staying in there longer and protects better? Basic fundamentals is, that when pressure is applied something has to give, right? So the oil is going to squeeze out, at what speed? approx. The same speed since both have measured the same and are rated the same."

"After the base oil has sheared or squeezed out, The last line of defense is an additive that puts down a barrier film. This additive usually has higher levels of strength against shearing so it helps keep the wear down."

"All oil's film strength will shear under stress or pressure. The real way to help prevent wear is to maintain higher levels of antiwear additives. This in conjunction with a good base stock will resists breakdown from high heat."
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racer12306
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't say a synthetic protected better than a conventional.

It will last longer.
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Ghost Neon
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 7:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

racer12306 wrote:
So that 7500 - 10000 mile oil change intervals are attainable.


That truly made me lol all the way downstairs. Made me think of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv3iYOh4vdw

I would watch my oil like a hawk, but if it lasted that long, swell. I'd have to have a dual filtration system, like what Drakito is using on his neon. IIRC, he does not change his oil for very extended periods of time.



[img]http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/8919/1009365dk7.jpg[img]








Synthetic does protect better. Have a look:

http://www.carjunky.com/news/motor_oil/mom2.shtml

Decent article. Also gives an ideal how it would leak out of a perfectly running car. It is man made designed for lubrication purposes, composed of uniform molecules of the same size and shape. Petroleum based oil are composed of large and small molecules. The larger molecules (in theory) blanket most leak areas keeping the oil in place. No leaks.

You get what you pay for (98.9% of the time) in life. Synthetic flows the "same," but does it better if that makes sense. It is more organized, so it dissipates heat better, and leaves less carbon deposits when burned. It is worth the money IMO, if your engine can keep it in there.[img][/img]
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chris97dohc
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 7:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

protection in this context is the oild ability to prevent contact between wear surfaces. synthetic does NOT protect better. both oils of the same viscosity flow the same and have very similar shear points. doing shearing oil film is the only thing separating wear surfaces. a films resistance to heat and shear are controlled by anti wear aditives in mineral and synthetic oils. therefore if a mineral oil has more anti wear aditive than the synthetic oil, the mineral oil offers more protection, and it works the other way around to.

"regular oil STARTS breaking down sooner on a gradual curve (since the molecules are different sizes they fail at different temps).
Synth oil is stable till the breakdown point and then sharply goes to hell in a handbasket (same size molecules all fail at the same time)."

credit to: RicksNeon - from the big org.

so the only thing synthetic offers over regular oil is the ability to not break down for longer periods of time. and thats if its not pushed to its breaking point. after that its all worthless.

that being said, even though it has the ability to last longer without breaking down, it offers the same protection as regular oil wich means the engines wear surfaces are still losing particles of metal over time that gets mixed into the oil. so it still needs to be changed unless you consider particles of metal floating around in new oil safe and clean.
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racer12306
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone that thinks oil filters don't do anything is a very special person in my book.

How about this rig up a setup that eliminates the filter element and see how long things last, ever at the 3000 mile changes.
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chris97dohc
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes oil filters are important, but they do not catch everything. when you break in an engine, (if you do it this way), you let it run for 30 minutes and change the oil and filter, drive it for 40 miles and change the oil and filter, drive it for 400 miles and change the oil and filter, then drive it for 1000 miles and change the oil and filter. at each oil and filter change until the engine is completely broken in you will always find the oil to be contaminated with tiny metal particles even though a new filter was used in between every oil change. yes, a hell of a lot of stuff is cought in the oil filter each time, but the smaller particles obviously go right through since its still in the oil.
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racer12306
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those little particles is called wear on a fresh break-in
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chris97dohc
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

exactly the same stuff thats in your oil after break in but in less quanity.
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Opi
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

this thread made me Laughing


on another note, read the owners manuel of the current car you own. it'll tell you when to change the oil in your car. for my chevy cobalt, GM tells me to change it when the DIC tells me to.

therefore, i don't touch my oil, until my car tells me too

engineers of the car > come bullshit oil company looking to make more money off of me


i too, use royal purple. it does not leak in a single car i've owned. Yes, it's more expensive, but the color purple = awesome
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chris97dohc
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thank you. ill make sure to make all my important dicissions from now on based on color.
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Opi
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oh i love when people can't read sarcasm

back to 2gn i go
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chris97dohc
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

quotes from Aircooled.net - tech talk

"Whether it's evil stuff or good stuff depends on who you talk to. And a lot of what you hear from backyard mechanics is rumor and myth.

Myth # 1 is the claim that you don't have to change Synthetic oil as often as regular motor oil.

Myth #1 debunked

Oil does not break down under normal use. This is true of both dino and synth oil and is also the reason why you take oil to the Recycling Center and not the trash dump. So if oil itself doesn't ever degrade, why do we have to change it? The answer is twofold: additives and contamination. It will probably surprise you to learn that synthetic oil has all the same additives that dino oil has! The additives in oil DO break down, which is part of what necessitates oil changes. The other reason for regular oil changes is that with use, motor oil becomes contaminated (dirt, water, acids, etc). Using synthetic oil does not protect against either of these problems, which is why you CANNOT go further between oil changes when running a synthetic. You should still change your synthetic oil at the same intervals as you do with dino oil.

At Aircooled.Net we recommend that you run synthetic oils in all cases, with one exception: you should continue to run dino oil (and change it every 1k miles w/o filter or 3k w/ filter) if your car still has the stock oiling system.

Myth #2 is that synthetic oil causes oil leaks.

Myth #2 debunked

Synthetic oil causing oil leaks is another commonly spread myth. The truth of the matter is that if all your engine seals and gaskets are in good condition, synthetic oil will NOT leak in your engine. The myth started because on occasion, an engine will leak with synthetic oil, but not dino oil. The reason for this is that the smaller molecules of the synthetic are able to get past very small crevices, where the larger molecules of dino oil cannot. But this does not mean that the synthetic oil has caused the leak, it simply has "discovered" an infant leak, and regardless of what oil you are running, this infant leak will eventually grow to a size that will allow dino oil to occupy and pass also. Synthetic oil has not been shown to deteriorate engine seals or gaskets. It is not some evil solvent that will break down sealant, or anything like that. Like was said earlier, it is just a man-made base stock, that is uniform and smaller in molecule size than dino oil. Nothing more, nothing less.
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racer12306
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Then I guess the thousands and thousands of used oil analysis are wrong.

Stupid science.
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INVUJerry
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chris97dohc wrote:
you should continue to run dino oil (and change it every 1k miles w/o filter or 3k w/ filter) if your car still has the stock oiling system.


You realize they are talking about an AIRCOOLED VW MOTOR right? That motor was originally designed in the fucking 30's. Of course they say use DINO oil. The oil is part of the cooling on that motor. On a neon, the oldest of these motors are 15 years old, and that's an early build 95.

You can pay to have your oil analyzed. A 3K oil change on dino is around the same as a 6K change on synthetic, this has been studied on 2gn.org. If you have a proprely designed car, it wont get fucked up. If the motor is donezo from the get-go, it'll get fucked up.
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chris97dohc
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok i give. synthetic is better.
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