seat-back repair

Post Reply
theCOOP
1GN n00b
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:48 am

seat-back repair

Post by theCOOP » Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:56 am

This is a how-to I wrote up after repairing the badly worn sport seats in a 1997 Plymouth Expresso Coupe, and subsequently also performed on my 1997 Dodge Sport Coupe.

Though this may not be the be-all and end-all of the repair, the repair on the first seat has so-far lasted more than three months.

As it first appeared on neons.org:

regarding this thread: http://forums.neons.org/viewtopic.php?p=2139122#2139122

So a bit of a proper write-up on my driver-seat repair.

Types of seats and interchangeability

Interchangeability

There are at least three basic styles of seats used in all 1st generation neons: those found in base-model cars, non-sport models, and sport/expresso models.

All seats front and back, from all neons are a direct bolt-in to and from one-another regardless of sedan or coupe, 1st gen or 2nd gen, base or SRT-4. But beware, some 2nd generation Neons, including some SRT-4s have side airbags in the seats. These airbags will not work in your first generation neon.

Seats from a Sedan (or coupe) can be easily modified to work as a Coupe (or sedan) seat simply by swapping the recline (tilt forward) assembly between the two, with is bolted to the seat-back frame.

It has recently been confirmed that this swap can be performed as well, on viper-style SRT-4 seats to work properly in a 1st gen coupe. My only concern here would be the lower bolsters on the seatback pushing against and damaging the bolsters on the seat-bottom

A passenger-side seat (frame) CANNOT be properly used on the driver-side, or vise-versa because the recline mechanism bolted to one side cannot be used on the other side of the frame.

Types of Seats

Those seats that come on base model Neons have no poseable headrests. I have no first hand experience with these seats so I do not know if any of them have a recline feature but I assume those found in coupes have a tilt-forward feature to allow passengers into the back seat. I can only assume they are otherwise built like the others.

The next step up are the non-sport/non-expresso seats which are somewhat flat on the lower portion and have short, flatter side bolsters on the back, vertical portion and have poseable head rests.

The third are the so-called "Sport" seats which have the taller side bolsters on the lower portion and more pronounced, high bolsters on the seatback and offer the best support of all seats available in the first generation neon.

Seats found in coupes have a feature that allow the seat-back to tilt forward to allow passengers into the back-seat area. Sedan models do not have this feature, nor do they need it. However, if one drives a sedan and has access to a passenger-side seat from a coupe, let it be known that it's easier to access iems in the back seat, while seated in the driver seat, if one can tilt-forward the passenger seat.

Seat Construction - 1st gen, 2-door coupe and 4-door sedan

The neon's seats consist of an underlying frame to which the other components are attached. I know not whether the underlying frame is the same between the base seats through to the Sport seats but I assume they are different, depending on the height of the side bolsters on the seatback. On the Sport seats at least, the frame incorporates bent steel rod welded to the main frame that when installed, tucks into the bolster(s) and adds support. This is generally where the foam tears.

The lower seat cushion is moulded as one piece and is wrapped in the upholstery fabric. This assembly sits on the lower steel frame, and is attached under the back side with hog-rings, and the upholstery is held taught with plastic channels that clip to the underside of the frame on all four sides.

The seat-back foam has an integrated flap that wraps over the top of the tubular frame and another that wraps under the bottom of the tubular frame. At the bottom, the flap is held taught by either hog rings attached to the frame (sedan seat I took apart) or to a short bar molded into the back of the foam (on the coupe seat I was repairing).

The welded-steel tubular frame of the sedan seat I dissasembled had an additional tube running horizontally through, near the bottom of it that the sedan seat did not. i do not know if this was a running safety change, or a difference between coupes and sedans. On this seat, with the rear-cushion in place, two large plastic plugs push into the ends of this added tube, and have large flanges that press against the outsides of the foam bolsters on each side.

The seat sliders are bolted (10mm socket) to the bottom of the lower seat frame at the front underside and to the back at the sides.

Though the sliders can physically be bolted in either the driver side location or the passenger side location, they are built side-specific in tems of the recline mechanism, the seat-back pivot on the other side, and in terms of the seatbelt latch mounting location.

AMMENDMENT TO NEONS.ORG POST:

this may not be true, the sliders may be swapable between passenger and driver side, coupe and sedan, for all years. I will need to confirm this

AMMENDMENT TO NEONS.ORG POST:

Though passenger side seatback foams are NOT a direct swap to driver side (needs some trimming), the bottoms are, frame and all. This means you can take a less-worn Coupe or Sedan passenger side seat-bottom and use it on the driver side.

Dissasembly

Though it is not necessary to dismantle the entire seat to remove the head rest, head-rest mounts, the uphulstery or the foam from the seatback, it is necessary to remove the sliders from the bottom of the seat to remove the upholstery and foam from the seat bottom.

I found it best to first remove the headrest:

1) before removing the seat from the car, press a small allen wrench or similar ridgid pin into the small hole on the right side of each of the plastic caps at the base of the head rest bars. Doing so will release the locking tab inside, allowing you to pull the head rest out of the top of the seat, thus minimising any damage to the delicate head rest during further dissasembly.

Steps 2, 3 and 4 and not necessary if removing the seat-back foam for repair or replacement, and is only necessary if you want to dissasemble the entire seat, or if replacing the seat-bottom.

2) remove the seatbelt latch assembly using a large torx bit in a ratchet.

3) remove the two 10mm bolts holding the seat-back to the lower frame.

4) slide back the rail portions that bolt to the floor of the car and remove the two 10mm bolts from the underside of the front of the lower seat frame (one on each side) and remove the two 10mm bolts from the back at the sides (one per side).

Now, the seat-back apholstery is secured by a long plastic clip at the bottom which can be tricky to seperate. I used a small flathead screwdriver to pop one end apart. Once one end is seperated, the rest is easy to release.

5) Start removing the upholstery by flipping the bottom edge inside out, effectively peeling the upholstery off. Both sides of the "insert" or middle section of the seatback upholstery is held into position with strips of hook and loop (velcro) fastener.

The lower and upper portions of the seat-back upholstery "insert" are seperated by a horizontal tab with a steel rod going through. This steel rod is attached to a corresponding steel rod embedded in the foam pad by hog rings. These hog rings will have to be cut, or otherwise removed in order to remove the upholstery.

6) Once the upholstery is about half way up, the plasic bits that the headrest fits into can be reached. Remove these by reaching up inside the seat and finding these plastic inserts. Once you found it/them, locate the two tabs holding it in place and then squeeze and push upward.

7) Remove the upholstery.

The seat foam may also be attached at the bottom by hog rings. They may already have been torn out. If still attached, remove them, and remove the cushion.

If you have a good replacement driver side cushion, assembly is the opposite of diassembly. However if you're only been able to locate a simmilar passenger side seat/cushion, then it'll have to be modified.

Repair of existing seat-back cushion

If you are repairing the existing cushion, then any cracks can be glued back together and then rienforced on the outer surface by gluing in some type of material to span the crack. I used 3M Super 77 spray adhesive following the directions on the can for application.

If the cushion is torn completely through, you may consider finding a new cushion or using a hooked upholstery needle and heavy thread to suture the crack closed from the inside out, using glue as you progress. It's best to address each and every crack, no matter how small or insignificant. If there is a significant amount of material worn away from either side of the crack, your best course of action is to find a better piece, or find a suitable filler material (maybe cut from the worse cushion).

Using a passenger side seat-back cushion

For most intents and purposes as long as you have the same style of seat (otherwise, coupe or sedan) then front surface of the seat-backs are going to look identical. However there is a difference at the back where the seat-back frame tucks into the back/sides.

The difference is in terms of the space behind, alotted to fit the recline mechanism. On the driver side seat, there's more room behing the bolster on the left side. On the passenger side seat, this space is ofcourse behind the right side bolster.

So, if using a passenger side seat cushion on a driver side seat, you will need to replicate the opening on the right-side to fit over the driver-side recline mechanism on the left side of the seat.

Once this is complete and the cushion fits, you could glue some fabric or other stabalising material to the cut area to rienforce it.

Reassembly is the opposite os dissasembly.


I have yet to find a product suitable for stengthening a worn/loose headrest shy of splitting it apart and filling the voids bwtween the foam and metal frame, or some kind of flexible filler in a syringe, injected through the foam.

I have yet to find the necessay materials to mold new seat-back foam.

Thanks,
Coop
12/28/06
Image
1995 Iris SOHC ATX Sedan - junked
1995 Metallic Green Dodge Neon Sport, SOHC MTX sedan
1997 Bright White Dodge Neon Sport, DOHC MTX coupe
1997 Metallic Green Plymouth Neon Expresso DOHC MTX Coupe
(mostly) smoke free since 12/31/2006

theCOOP
1GN n00b
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:48 am

Post by theCOOP » Fri May 04, 2007 7:30 pm

so apparently the seat rails are not interchangeable side to side.

I was going to use a rust-free pair of pass side rails on my driver side, but they're side-specific...unless you want to dismantle them, and just swap the portion that bolts down.
Image
1995 Iris SOHC ATX Sedan - junked
1995 Metallic Green Dodge Neon Sport, SOHC MTX sedan
1997 Bright White Dodge Neon Sport, DOHC MTX coupe
1997 Metallic Green Plymouth Neon Expresso DOHC MTX Coupe
(mostly) smoke free since 12/31/2006

theCOOP
1GN n00b
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:48 am

Post by theCOOP » Sun May 06, 2007 6:24 pm

some recent pics, repairing another seat.

Just picked up ANC Coupe seats for use in the NYG ACR Coupe. The NYG came with the mid-level Tango seats which are ugly as hell.

Typical of most Sport neon seats, the front driver seat has seen better days. This one in particular is a bit thread bare on an outer bolster seam. The foam in behind this side isn't torn on the front, but the backing material on the back is partially pulled away and the bolster is slightly hollow. There is likely a pocked of crumbly foam within the bolster.

The other side is torn, like usual (this likely occurs from reaching behind, while seated, to the back seat. Each seat I've taken apart so far has been torn on the inboard bolster whether passenger side or driver side.

The passenger side seat is mint aside from one odd stain. I'll likely modify this seat foam to be used on the driver side. I'll use the pass seat bottom and pass side seat back fabric.


Some pics:

The stains you see show up more in the pics than in person
Image

Front passenger seat
Image

thread bare seam on driver side fabric. I'll have to put this in the sewing machine and do my best with it, sewing another seam about 1/8" inboard of this one. I'll need to find a suitable foam to glue back onto the inside of the fabric too.
Image
Image

Some pics of the seat-back foam
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image

2-door driver side seat-back frame (driver side). Note the 2 crossbars. On this particular frame, these bars are very thin and wire-like. On other Coupe frames (and the sedan frame pictured next) they're considerably thicker.
Image

2-door flip forward mechanism
Image

4-door seat frame (passenger side, note the added bar near the bottom). I am not using this frame at all. I'm just showing it for reference to my original post.
Image

4-door recline-only mechanism
Image
Image
1995 Iris SOHC ATX Sedan - junked
1995 Metallic Green Dodge Neon Sport, SOHC MTX sedan
1997 Bright White Dodge Neon Sport, DOHC MTX coupe
1997 Metallic Green Plymouth Neon Expresso DOHC MTX Coupe
(mostly) smoke free since 12/31/2006

Post Reply