2 tips to run cooler

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purplehayz
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2 tips to run cooler

Post by purplehayz » Fri Aug 03, 2007 12:23 pm

To all of u with a plastic intake manifold, get rid of it. go 2 scrapper and find the aluminum ones. Standerd on r/t and expressos. intake runs 20% cooler and can be pollished like glass.

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_im ... 4_full.jpg

Excellant how-to @ http://www.angelfire.com/space/neon/manifold.html

2nd modify your rad mouts I saw it on another site and it gives 1 more inch for air to travel infront of motor.Remove mount pivot 45 deg and cut excess pic will follow I've got to take 1
Honda has 1.6L
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purplehayz
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Post by purplehayz » Fri Aug 03, 2007 12:50 pm

Here's pic of mnt.
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_im ... 7_full.jpg
U can c the differance it also lightens car by couple oz's every bit counts
I thank chrono_killa for the example mnt used
Honda has 1.6L
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6(sic)6
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Post by 6(sic)6 » Fri Aug 03, 2007 1:24 pm

^How can you claim an aluminum intake mani vs a plastic one runs "cooler" The aluminum heat-soaks like a motherfucker in about 5 minutes, Plastic one never does.....



ps, you can port the plastic one also.....
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Post by purplehayz » Fri Aug 03, 2007 1:59 pm

The aluminum sheds haet faster as air passed over it therefor despelling heat from the motor . plastic ones don't heat up so you don't loose that heat . think of the aluminum one as a heat sink drawing heat from motor . I've put it to the test with a simple digital thermometrr. to make it more effective Cut the coolent section free and replace it with the one from a pt cruiser
Finally the plactic ones can't be polished nearly the same allowing faster flow of air in turn permoting cooling once again you can also open it up much more allowing for higher CFM. There is no way I would believe plastic to be better in anywas, it's just cheeper. If u put in the time belive me u wont be disappointed. Don't take my word for it ask any pro racer or any garage that does performance work. (Extrud honing). aluminum polishes like glass
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Post by 6(sic)6 » Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:06 pm

The single cam manifold already has a seperate waterneck????????

The alum one gets real hot from being bolted to the head. It HEATS up the air going into it because its heatsoaked from the head heating it up.

ALSO,
I didnt say plastic ports better I just meant that it is "possible" to do.


I gurantee on a sohc the plastic Int Mani dosent heatsoak and warm the air comming into it nowhere close to how much the alum one does. Your not going to lower intake temps by using your intake mani to be used as a heatsink for the head. Its just going to be heting up you incomming air big time.



How did you measure your intake temps with a didital thermometer?

I thought only the sohc came with a "nylon" int mani?
What motor are you talking about ditching the plastic mani?

Tons of people do seperate the waterneck on their dohc's
Last edited by 6(sic)6 on Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by purplehayz » Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:25 pm

I wasn't aware the sohc was seperated the dohc is not and coolant passing through the waterneck really heats it up. As for measuring intake temp get a kitchen thermometer, some of the modern ones the probe is attached to 3' of cable so you can reach into the oven ( about ($30) at kitchen supply store.. Remove intake pipe/ air box/ CAI and feed cable into TB and run the car Figure out something to keep tip of probe off the manifold it's self I just bent a piece of coat hanger as a brace. A little crude but it works. I know a few people I race actually mounted it permanetly as an inexpencive gauge.
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Post by 6(sic)6 » Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:31 pm

^ Thats pretty ghetto haha

I was confused as to what motor was in discusion here. I dont use a kitchen probe to measure int temps, Iam running megasquirt with an actuall IAT in the manifold.....


I fully agree the waterneck drasticly heats up the intake mani but it being bolted to the head heats it up alot also and thats where the plastic one out performs the alum one. It dosent heatsoak and heat up the intake charge.


If you really want to reduce the temp of the intake mani buy a "Hondata" heatsheild intake manifold gasket!!! It gets the head away from the int mani by about a 1/4".
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Post by purplehayz » Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:36 pm

I haven't got an IAT nor have I got spare pods for another gauge so I just cheeted to give me an idea.
I'll take a look into the Hondata gasket right now I usa per,atex ultra copper
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Post by 6(sic)6 » Fri Aug 03, 2007 3:14 pm

Its made out of a plastic type material. I think modernperformance sells them now too. Also an IAT
(Intake Air Temp) sensor, dosent go to a guage. Its used with megasquirt among alot of other things witch you veiw on a laptop.....
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Re: 2 tips to run cooler

Post by DOHCRT » Fri Aug 03, 2007 5:27 pm

purplehayz wrote:To all of u with a plastic intake manifold, get rid of it. go 2 scrapper and find the aluminum ones. Standerd on r/t and expressos. intake runs 20% cooler and can be pollished like glass.
This post makes no sense. There is nothing wrong with the plastic intake manifold. The plastic runners are already smoother than the aluminum.

Why would you want your intake manifold to absorb heat from the engine? Thats just dumb. The cooling system is sufficient enough to keep the head at the proper temperature.

Let me explain to you thermal efficiency. An engines thermal efficiency can be split into three parts. 1/3 of its efficiency is absorbed through the metal parts of the engine and the cooling system. Another third is used to create power through the heat expansion caused by combustion. The last third is expelled by through the exhaust. So, only 1/3 of the heat produced by the engine is used to create power. You cannot have an engine with 100% thermal efficiency. How can you increase thermal efficiency? Turbochargers. The turbo uses heat that is normally wasted through the exhaust to create more power by improving volumetric efficiency.

Expelling engine heat through the intake manifold does nothing but heat the intake charge at the head more. Think about it. The plastic manifold does not absorb nearly as much heat from the engine or the radiator fan. The less heat it absorbs, the less heat that will be transfered to the intake air. An aluminum manifold will not absorb heat from the intake air, because it has more heat than the intake air. Therefore, the intake air will absorb heat from the aluminum intake manifold.

You cannot destroy heat. It can only be transfered.

The only time the aluminum intake manifold is better is when it is chopped up, ported, and made into a box manifold.
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6(sic)6
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Post by 6(sic)6 » Fri Aug 03, 2007 6:31 pm

^ Thats exactly what I was trying to say to him.

You did a much better job than I did
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Post by sohcneon13x » Fri Aug 03, 2007 7:07 pm

Well said DOHCRT!
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Post by racyneon » Fri Aug 03, 2007 7:14 pm

Im confused. Plastic or nylon mani s are olny found on sohcs. How do you put a mani from a rt which is a dohc on a sohc? It wouldnt work.
98 r/t: 2.0L=3 spun rod bearings. Starting 2.4L build with srt internals.
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Post by purplehayz » Fri Aug 03, 2007 11:06 pm

Racyneon just made my point .
If plastic is so much batter y is the r/t, Expresso aluminum for thet matter all 2nd gen are 2 as well as srt.
It's not cheaper in fact plastic is much cheaper. I understand the thermal dynamics of it I've got a dagree in physics from Carleton U in Ontario.
Despite the fact it is very pitted but no 1 is arguing p&p capabilities as well as the fact u can boar it right out.
This allows faster less turbulant air flow, increased CFM, The added air flow absorbs more heat then slower more turbulant air. Like DOHCRT said u cant destroy haet and a turbocharger recycles exhust heat.
Once again my point your block will run cooler for that very reason u r reducing the heat in the block by recycling it
I can run my car for half an hour at high rev's, pull over pop the hood and put my hand on the intake yes it's warm but not nearly a hot as the stock Al DOHC mani is
If u r going 2 get in 2 the Thermal dynamics of it that is only half the equation u must take in to acount added air volume and air speed this permotes the transfer of heat. No the car doesnt get an ice cold breath of air but with everything combined the car runs cooler.
And for added effect (my next step) cut a vent in your hood , not a scoop to catch air but a vent to allow more flow under the hood dispersing even more heat. same as removing the weather stripping
I'm not trying to cause an argument but go track side at your local race track and speak with some of the machanics
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Post by fusion210 » Sat Aug 04, 2007 12:13 am

You boggle my mind purplehayz much like infinity, the human brain was not made to understand such nonsense spewn forth such as your posts. I can't see a beginning or an end. I'll just pick something right in the middle, seems as good as any as a spot.

Using 'plastic' as a material is far better than aluminum.
Nylon under the hood wrote:The Dodge Neon's 2 L engine made of Zytel nylon 66, weighing just 2.9lb. highlights the benefits the US market has gained with the adoption of nylon intake manifolds. In comparison, a manifold in aluminum for Neon's dual overhead cam weighs 12lb. The thermoplastic manifold is also credited for a 2 percent horsepower boost.
http://plastics.dupont.com/plastics/pdf ... r_hood.pdf
Read more if you can wrap your head around it.

Second. Have you ever even seen the bolt pattern and ports of a dohc head vs the single cam head?
I'm thinking no, so here is a picture of an intake manifold comparison.
Image
Just a hunch, I will have to point out which one is which. DOHC on the left. Note how much smaller the sohc runner opening is. Put a dohc intake manifold on a sohc head even after cutting the waterneck off and drilling mounting holes and the ports arn't going to match.

Third, just to have a third point, what?
purplehayz wrote:2nd modify your rad mouts I saw it on another site and it gives 1 more inch for air to travel infront of motor.Remove mount pivot 45 deg and cut excess pic will follow I've got to take 1
The whole point of moving the radiator forward is to force air through it. There is a gap between the radiator/air conditioning condenser and the radiator support. Air pressure builds in front and takes the path of least resistance preventing air cooling the radiator. It has nothing to do with creating more space between the radiator and the engine unless it's specifically done for intake manifold fitment to clear the fans. Your whole idea of cooling the block is asinine as the engine is not air cooled.
purplehayz wrote:I understand the thermal dynamics of it I've got a dagree in physics from Carleton U in Ontario.
No, you really don't understand and I highly doubt your claim of a degree. For Canada's sake I hope that English is not your first language.

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